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25x50 Pill shaped bases from warbases.co.uk works great for my Norman mounted knights. Double size of a normal 25mm base, it seems to fit nicely into SAGA.

Bergh wrote:25x50 Pill shaped bases from warbases.co.uk works great for my Norman mounted knights. Double size of a normal 25mm base, it seems to fit nicely into SAGA.

Yea - those are what I'm planning on using for cavalry - I like the 'pill' (capsule) shape... but what to use for Mounted Warlords?

I also use thir measuring sticks and fatigue markers which I would readily recomend

EDIT - I checked with warbases.co.uk and they can make custom pill bases to size

We can do custom pill shaped bases and I have quoted you below:

30mm x 55mm = £1.20 for a pack of 10
40mm x 60mm = £1.20 for a pack of 9

P&P is dependent on quantities ordered, but is always kept to a minimum.

Ragnar, I see there is already some debate about this subject. Could you please clarify the INTENTION of the rulewriters about the ability of mounted figures in a second rank being able to fight? The detailed question is outlined below.

Congratulations on a superb set of rules that really do cover everything on one side of foolscap paper (OK 2 sides if you include the battleboard). The quick reference sheet really is the only thing you need to refer to, and then only rarely.

Being a good Viking I understand the best way to fight and I organise my Warriors, (each figure mounted on 20mm square bases), into blocks of 12 men, 4 wide and 3 deep, all bases touching. This formation ensures that, in the event of me being attacked, most of my Warriors will have a chance to fight in melee because figures in the rear ranks are more likely to be within VS range of an engaged enemy figure. Furthermore, this formation does not disadvantage me when my Warriors charge forward and attack the enemy.

Most, if not all, of my opponents’ base their infantry figures on bases this size. However, the cowardly Welsh and Normans insist on riding ponies and warhorses, (nags). These mounted Warriors and Hearthguard are mostly based on bases 25mm x 50mm.

The rules say that basing is not important and that no player should suffer a disadvantage from basing.

My question is this. Although advantages are given to mounted Norman and Welsh troops via the battleboards, was it the intention that mounted figures in a second rank could fight in a melee. For example; If 8 mounted Norman or Welsh warriors, (4 figures wide by 2 deep and all in base to base contact), moved into, (frontal), contact with a unit of my Vikings formed as described earlier; how many mounted figures could fight in the melee?

All of my Viking Warriors would fight because they are all in direct contact with an enemy figure, or within VS distance from and engaged enemy figure, i.e. 12 attack dice. Ignoring the battleboard, how many attack dice would the Normans get? Even if all the mounted figures are packed as closely as possible together, the rear rank can never be within VS range of an engaged enemy because the usual depth of a mounted base is itself VS distance, (50mm). If this is the intention, the Normans only get 4 attack dice. However, if the intention was for a second rank of mounted figures to be able to fight, (i.e. if the length of a mounted base was, say, 45mm), then the Normans would be allowed 8 attack dice, a big difference.

I am not afraid of mounted Normans or Welshmen so I say two ranks can fight but what do you say?

We/I Always play with mounted models 25x50mm can fight in 1 supporting rang. ie. 2 ranks totally. and infantry on 25mm round bases can support in 2 ranks. ie. 3 totally.
Else really the mounted models are too weak. You can actually fit your mounted models only smaller bases then 25x50mm. They are perfectly fine on 25x45mm or even smaller.
but it looks really stupid.

dominic8: I think you have a nice balanced way to thinking and understanding on how the game should be played, please keep up that friendly spirit!

20mm square bases really does not mix up with 25x50mm bases for "balance" if you run the rules really strict, then mounted bases should be 20x40mm, then its no problem with support within VS. If people agree to the understanding of the imbalance of different base sizes, then there are no problems.

If people can't understand or won't understand that smaller bases give an advantage in SAGA, ie. being competitive about base size, then I have two choices:
1. I will buy som cheap plastic miniatures, mount them on 10-15mm bases and then really be "That guy". possible ruining your gaming experience all together.
2. Pack up my miniatures and leave without any talk or argue, such people are not worth wasting your time on playing.

This post if not to offend anyone, or any specific person is targeted. Just stating that basing size does matter in SAGA, and I personally I have chosen to be really arrogant about it! Maybe it will get me fewer opponent to play against, but the games I get, will just get that much better. Powergamers have destroyed my interest in most games, and I standing my ground on on wanting to play SAGA.

We will add some recommandations about base sizes in the Tournament rules pack that we are currently slightly reworking to prevent things like that to happen in a competitve environment.

That being said, I still think that the best way to deal with people who are abusing the freedom we leave regarding base sizes is a to get some nails, a wood plank and some throwing axes. That would make some fun out of it...

Dominic8 wrote:
Even if all the mounted figures are packed as closely as possible together, the rear rank can never be within VS range of an engaged enemy because the usual depth of a mounted base is itself VS distance, (50mm)
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VS distance is 2 inches, which is 50.8mm, so a second rank of mounted on 50mm bases are definitely within VS.
A clarification that 'within' means 'at or less than' is probably a good idea to avoid arguments if you use metric distances, though.

Even if you used metric measuring with 50mm VS and 50mm bases, edge to edge the rear rank is still within VS.

Pyruse
The point of this thread is that there is no 'usual' base size.
This is further complicated by the two different sets of measurements given in the book - VS is either 50mm or 2" (50.8mm), L is either 30cm or 12" (304.8mm), etc.

I know both of my normal adversaries use 49mm long bases specifically so they are inside both the metric and the imperial VS and the second rank fights.
I use elliptical bases that are 50x25 for my mounted.
The curved aspect allows the rear rank to nestle forward a tad to be within VS.

It's apparent from the recent posts that people are now asking 'what did the designers really want to happen in this type of interaction?'

If the intent was that second row mounted never get to fight, then we're mangling that intent.

From what I can see the intent was to remove the need for micro measurements, but the actual text has left us with exactly the opposite position.
It's a quandry really at odd with the free flowing and more natural rules style in the rest of the book.

Si

When you watch the guys run demo games the intent looks simple. Unit fights unit. Even with pedantic measuring we have had very few melded where this doesn't work out. So unless it's an obvious space constraint we play unit fights unit.

Rich
I totally agree with you - tends to be what happens with us too - apart from the odd occaision where a long strung out line of levies gets caught on one end.